Brilliant! Very proud to host you, hosting on the podcast. You always class this place up a notch as my father used to say. And you give us all courage.
I'm in the US. I just had a surreal moment at the local pool. A friend asked me eagerly if I am excited about Harris. It tool ma a moment - I actually said "Harris?", then realized what she meant. I couldn't just nod and smile, so I talked about wanting to avoid war, about how there has been no primary, and other glaring (for me) issues.
My friend did a pivot straight to how chaotic it was when Trump was president (I never said I wanted Trump) and how two of her friends died from COVID in the hospital (!).
So I did speak out, but it was pretty unsatisfying because my friend is obviously not open to considering any other ideas. I can't just smile and agree, which would be easiest. Doubtful, but maybe it will at least plant a seed...
We are dealing with a brainwashed citizenry. I tried to keep off politics here at the cottage but we got into it a bit. Surprising how little people actually know about what has happened for the last decade. Dem talking points slip off the tongue as if learned wisdom and there is no changing of minds. So back to paddleboarding and movies.
A nice example of self own. No offense intended. This dynamic was started by Ronald Reagan. For over 40 years, we have had the illegitimate choice of corporate oligarchy enabled fascism or totalitarian despotism. Aside from that, choice is an illusion.
Sadly, your experience is typical. You can and should express a contrary opinion but recognize that it invariably leads to short conversations. Most people have a superficial understanding of current events that satisfies their biases or is regarded as acceptable. For a myriad of reasons they are unprepared or simply unwilling to engage in debate. All you can do is state your case and move on. A satisfying exchange is a rare occurrence.
I recall when a friend of my wife’s started talking about what a bad person Bill Gates is and was. I was curious as to how one of the richest people on the planet would choose to engage in all of his antics. This was year one of Covid and I had no idea, what a terrible human being he really is. I’m always happy to hear different viewpoints on different matters and so many of us have changed our views regarding matters such as Covid, climate change, and Mass Graves to name a few.
Quinn, regarding Kamala Harris, you may be interested in knowing that on the July 19, 2019 emission of the CBC Radio show “The Sunday Edition”, Peter Armstrong said: “One of the latest examples…. Right-wing activist Ali Alexander tweeted that Kamala Harris -- a Democratic presidential hopeful who was born in Oakland, California -- was ‘not an American black.’ Once it was retweeted by Donald Trump, Junior, a new birther movement took flight. As Mr. Alexander put it, ‘one tweet can change everything.’” The implication was that evil Donald Trump Jr.’s new birther movement was going to destroy Kamala Harris’s career. It would be difficult to think of any political prediction ever that was more totally wrong. Only a little more than five years since then, Harris has been the US VP for three and a half years and will soon become the first black woman to be the Democratic Party’s presidential candidate. The viciousness of the lie behind this is hard to overstate. Rather than being a right-wing activist it would have been more accurate to say that Ali Alexander was a black rights activist, particularly concerned with the issue of reparations to black Americans for slavery. His actual tweet was:
“Kamala Harris is *not* an American Black. She is half Indian and half Jamaican.
“I’m so sick of people robbing American Blacks (like myself) of our history. It’s disgusting. Now using it for debate time at #DemDebate2?
“These are my people, not her people.
“Freaking disgusting.”
Everyone should feel sympathy with how far short what most freed slaves got after the Civil War from what was promised them. Most never received their forty acres and a mule. That doesn’t mean that reparations to black Americans today for those broken promises is good policy. But if you do think it is a good policy, like Alexander, it makes sense to distinguish between black Americans like himself who are the descendants of black American slaves and black Americans like Harris, whose father was a black Jamaican, and have no such claim. It’s like Julie Ponesse said in her column, even if you don’t agree with someone else, you should at least try to understand their perspective on the world. Alexander was not saying that Harris, with black Jamaican ancestry, might not suffer from discrimination from white racists or whatever, only that none of her ancestors were a part of black American history. Therefore they had no claims to reparations. The last part was not explicitly said in the tweet but if you read the comments on it from other black Americans it was clearly understood by them. No-one thought he meant that Harris was born somewhere in Jamaica and not in California. It turned out that Donald Trump Jr. only retweeted it because he was unaware that Harris had a mother from India. He also wasn’t under the illusion that she was born abroad. But if you have a network with an extreme case of TDS like our CBC, any excuse to beat the anti-Trump drum is a good one, even if you are obviously distorting the views of Ali Alexander, which Donald Trump Jr. only retweeted without explicitly endorsing.
Julie Ponesse I'm happy to express my gratitude for your strength, courage and honesty. You spoke out and gave us hope and a sense of connection. Until recently most of my honest conversations were one to one or in small groups, among like minds. In my small town I've joined a lively book club and started hosting a writers circle - within the Library community that cast me out in Oct 2021. I don't know how they might respond to writing about my history of medical harms and why I don't trust needles or those who deliver them.. but I won't be silenced. I will however remain kind, calm and polite.
Trish, thanks so much for continuing to bless us with your clarity of observation and thought.
Trish and Julie, between the two of you, just wow.
"Non-playable character" here. I try not to fret. But recent electoral tricks in France have got me obsessing un peu plus.
'Cause meanwhile, here in our version of France, the political "Left" are contriving a massive coalition to keep the faux PM at the helm - or maybe one of his colluders will get the chance to play king of the land once known as Canada.
There was one other thing I promised to link but forget now what it was. When it occurs to me, I'll pop on again and post (unless one of you can remind me first).
And thank you for your incredibly kind comments. I had so much fun. Thank you Trish!
The debate is about climate change, generally, but about blaming it on the West, specifically. I'll see if I can find footage of some other parts of the debate.
I’m able to find it and it’s entirety. Thank you for the kindness.
Denying the premise of responsibility is defending the indefensible.
Just because we have been overtaken on an annual basis by India and China, is not a relevant point.
As of January 1, 2024, the United States is responsible for almost 30% of over the 3,5 trillion tons of CO2 emissions. In the entirety of the dynamic. Twice that of China, the second largest contributor. That, not considering India is only in that position because of the corporate entities based in the west. Obviously, that is not the case with China.
Anyone arguing that 2+2 does not equal 4 is not worth one’s attention.
I am convinced that there is very little credible science behind the CO2 as pollutant argument.....at best, 2+2 looks like it might equal 4, I'm afraid.
Great conversation! In my own life, I don't often get a chance to express my (unpopular) views, 'cos my old leftie colleagues just kind of exiled me when I didn't/couldn't swallow the (various forms of) Kool-Aid. An abyss opened up between us, & it appears to be un-bridgeable (fortunately I do have many like-minded friends). I get to practice saying hard things with my grown daughters, who don't always want to hear what Mom has to say on certain topics. They still love me, even though they sometimes find me a pain in the ass! I've always had the writing outlet, too, where I can say difficult things to those who are prepared to read me. And now - something puzzled me in the conversation with Bruce Pardy. Julie, you started to quote something he'd said about climate change at some gathering or lecture, but you didn't say the whole thing. I was waiting with bated breath for it, since climate change has long occupied a big portion of my mind (30+ years doing environmental activism/writing) & I'm still open to learning where I may've gone down a wrong road in my thinking. Finally, I just love the way you concluded the podcast, with those words of wisdom about "the road less travelled." I've definitely lived the road less travelled, & it has been hugely rewarding!
Julie is sitting in for Trish! What a supply Trish got!! Well worth our time. Here is a gentle voice with a warrior heart and a brain that reasons and communicates with such clarity. Thanks Trish for reaching out to Julie. Julie, I am forever grateful for your presence in those moments when no one spoke out and all seemed to be disappearing, disappointing and demanding. When family, friends, faith leaders all collapsed to the narrative. Caught in this new reality, your voice was a lighthouse of hope, of sanity and of fight against what was unreal. As time worn on your speaking engagements, your interviews and your book(My Choice) instilled a vision of a discernment and new direction of coping. Thank you, thank you, 🙏🏼 I am so enjoying the latest book (Our Last Innocent Moment). Your voice will forever be held in my heart as a beacon of hope.
Anne, I couldn’t have put this any better. Warrior heart and lighthouse of hope indeed! Dr Julie will forever be a hero to me, a 59 year old (now retired!) teacher who barely survived the woke environment that surrounded me during covid. I just finished “Our Last Innocent Moment” and will confess, I teared up at many points, not just for my own pain but for Julie’s. I felt it coming through the pages. What it has cost her emotionally to save us, I can only imagine, but save us she did.❤️
Beautiful write up. I'm eager to listen to this week's pod, as well.
During Covid I resented feeling the need to keep silent, that my family couldn't handle considering anything other than 'Trump bad, Fauci right.' I have silently stewed in resentment on other topics over the last 9 years, as well.
Today this has been replaced by an oft-repeating pattern of me following my own curiosity to determine what I feel to be true and leaving others to do the same (or not.) I do engage with any who are willing to talk. And my wish is for everyone to activate their own critical thinking, knowing mine needs regular exercise, as well. Silence seems a sort of grace to me now - toward myself and others.
This doesn't mean I'm always interested in staying with people where they are, though. And definitely not on holiday ;)
Lots to think about here. I could write a post in response to almost everything said.
To focus on one thing. Yes we need to reframe the debate back to first principles with respect to the rule of law. Yes, we are now in the "rule by law". Yes, we need to focus the law on preventing violence & harm at the most basic level because we have lost sight of why we have laws, and now the laws are becoming irrational & random.
Order & Chaos are required for life. A perfectly ordered universe is DEAD. A Chaotic Universe will consume itself. Life, and progress happen at the boundary between Order & Chaos. The place where the answer is "Yes", "No", and "Maybe". The "Maybe" is hard because it is the wild card. The place where where things will happen we don't like or approve of is hard to accept. It is much easier to believe that everyone should do exactly as we say, and if they did the World would be perfect.
Since we are living by the "Rule of Laws" we have lost sight of what the Harms are that the rules are to prevent. The Rules have become the end, and the harm they are to prevent has been forgotten and the end result is not Order, but Chaos.
I am listening to this with interest. I think one of the issues that Julie has had (Less so Bruce, but still) is that they are in academia, which has always been notoriously political. In normal life, its easier to speak out, albeit at the risk of losing a few friends.
In my own personal experience, the further away an institution or organization is from being directly responsible for delivering goods or services into a marketplace, the more room there is for nonsense, politics and infighting. Research institutions etc are among the worst for this.
University of Guelph, Western, UBC et al alumni, hang your heads in eternal shame...your university took tax payer money to promote coercion causing injury and death. Shameful and unexcusable.
Thought provoking, to be reminded that silence is too often serving the interests of others. It is challenging to navigate - trying to keep connected enough to our people, that they dare open to our dissent, requires not jumping on every issue. But too easily this becomes perceived as agreement with all manner of dangerous ideas.
Though I appreciate the metaphor in context, one thought on NPCs etc that bubbled for me: more than anything else, we gotta get out of the scripted, coded game altogether, whenever possible. Because while playable characters are certainly restricted by skill level and contrived to perform only as avatars of those "outside" the game, NPCs have even less agency, relegated to simply advancing the vision of the game's creators by their unconscious actions. I fear the silence you describe is more like becoming an NPC, actually. So I think again: how best not to step into that coded world in the first place?
And for those that are interested in 'Enemy' ... one of the cleverest films of all time .. I'm the guy who decoded it ... you can check out my analysis here .... on my 'Keep Your Eye On The Donut' blog
Brilliant! Very proud to host you, hosting on the podcast. You always class this place up a notch as my father used to say. And you give us all courage.
Great post - thank you!
I'm in the US. I just had a surreal moment at the local pool. A friend asked me eagerly if I am excited about Harris. It tool ma a moment - I actually said "Harris?", then realized what she meant. I couldn't just nod and smile, so I talked about wanting to avoid war, about how there has been no primary, and other glaring (for me) issues.
My friend did a pivot straight to how chaotic it was when Trump was president (I never said I wanted Trump) and how two of her friends died from COVID in the hospital (!).
So I did speak out, but it was pretty unsatisfying because my friend is obviously not open to considering any other ideas. I can't just smile and agree, which would be easiest. Doubtful, but maybe it will at least plant a seed...
We are dealing with a brainwashed citizenry. I tried to keep off politics here at the cottage but we got into it a bit. Surprising how little people actually know about what has happened for the last decade. Dem talking points slip off the tongue as if learned wisdom and there is no changing of minds. So back to paddleboarding and movies.
A nice example of self own. No offense intended. This dynamic was started by Ronald Reagan. For over 40 years, we have had the illegitimate choice of corporate oligarchy enabled fascism or totalitarian despotism. Aside from that, choice is an illusion.
Sadly, your experience is typical. You can and should express a contrary opinion but recognize that it invariably leads to short conversations. Most people have a superficial understanding of current events that satisfies their biases or is regarded as acceptable. For a myriad of reasons they are unprepared or simply unwilling to engage in debate. All you can do is state your case and move on. A satisfying exchange is a rare occurrence.
I recall when a friend of my wife’s started talking about what a bad person Bill Gates is and was. I was curious as to how one of the richest people on the planet would choose to engage in all of his antics. This was year one of Covid and I had no idea, what a terrible human being he really is. I’m always happy to hear different viewpoints on different matters and so many of us have changed our views regarding matters such as Covid, climate change, and Mass Graves to name a few.
Especially, anything involving the body politic. Our collective ignorance of the process, and its current mechanizations is truly astounding.
Quinn, regarding Kamala Harris, you may be interested in knowing that on the July 19, 2019 emission of the CBC Radio show “The Sunday Edition”, Peter Armstrong said: “One of the latest examples…. Right-wing activist Ali Alexander tweeted that Kamala Harris -- a Democratic presidential hopeful who was born in Oakland, California -- was ‘not an American black.’ Once it was retweeted by Donald Trump, Junior, a new birther movement took flight. As Mr. Alexander put it, ‘one tweet can change everything.’” The implication was that evil Donald Trump Jr.’s new birther movement was going to destroy Kamala Harris’s career. It would be difficult to think of any political prediction ever that was more totally wrong. Only a little more than five years since then, Harris has been the US VP for three and a half years and will soon become the first black woman to be the Democratic Party’s presidential candidate. The viciousness of the lie behind this is hard to overstate. Rather than being a right-wing activist it would have been more accurate to say that Ali Alexander was a black rights activist, particularly concerned with the issue of reparations to black Americans for slavery. His actual tweet was:
“Kamala Harris is *not* an American Black. She is half Indian and half Jamaican.
“I’m so sick of people robbing American Blacks (like myself) of our history. It’s disgusting. Now using it for debate time at #DemDebate2?
“These are my people, not her people.
“Freaking disgusting.”
Everyone should feel sympathy with how far short what most freed slaves got after the Civil War from what was promised them. Most never received their forty acres and a mule. That doesn’t mean that reparations to black Americans today for those broken promises is good policy. But if you do think it is a good policy, like Alexander, it makes sense to distinguish between black Americans like himself who are the descendants of black American slaves and black Americans like Harris, whose father was a black Jamaican, and have no such claim. It’s like Julie Ponesse said in her column, even if you don’t agree with someone else, you should at least try to understand their perspective on the world. Alexander was not saying that Harris, with black Jamaican ancestry, might not suffer from discrimination from white racists or whatever, only that none of her ancestors were a part of black American history. Therefore they had no claims to reparations. The last part was not explicitly said in the tweet but if you read the comments on it from other black Americans it was clearly understood by them. No-one thought he meant that Harris was born somewhere in Jamaica and not in California. It turned out that Donald Trump Jr. only retweeted it because he was unaware that Harris had a mother from India. He also wasn’t under the illusion that she was born abroad. But if you have a network with an extreme case of TDS like our CBC, any excuse to beat the anti-Trump drum is a good one, even if you are obviously distorting the views of Ali Alexander, which Donald Trump Jr. only retweeted without explicitly endorsing.
Julie Ponesse I'm happy to express my gratitude for your strength, courage and honesty. You spoke out and gave us hope and a sense of connection. Until recently most of my honest conversations were one to one or in small groups, among like minds. In my small town I've joined a lively book club and started hosting a writers circle - within the Library community that cast me out in Oct 2021. I don't know how they might respond to writing about my history of medical harms and why I don't trust needles or those who deliver them.. but I won't be silenced. I will however remain kind, calm and polite.
Trish, thanks so much for continuing to bless us with your clarity of observation and thought.
Trish and Julie, between the two of you, just wow.
"Non-playable character" here. I try not to fret. But recent electoral tricks in France have got me obsessing un peu plus.
'Cause meanwhile, here in our version of France, the political "Left" are contriving a massive coalition to keep the faux PM at the helm - or maybe one of his colluders will get the chance to play king of the land once known as Canada.
Breathe deep. Play your way always. Promise?
Lots of good people are awake now....but yes, I am worried too.
Thank you Julie. Your ideas are the medicine and encouragement I needed to remind myself to take off my gag.
Hi everyone,
Below is the link to Bruce Pardy's Oxford Union climate change debate closing remarks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-qUJpGGKf0&t=14s
There was one other thing I promised to link but forget now what it was. When it occurs to me, I'll pop on again and post (unless one of you can remind me first).
And thank you for your incredibly kind comments. I had so much fun. Thank you Trish!
--Julie
If you would be so kind, what are they debating?
The debate is about climate change, generally, but about blaming it on the West, specifically. I'll see if I can find footage of some other parts of the debate.
I’m able to find it and it’s entirety. Thank you for the kindness.
Denying the premise of responsibility is defending the indefensible.
Just because we have been overtaken on an annual basis by India and China, is not a relevant point.
As of January 1, 2024, the United States is responsible for almost 30% of over the 3,5 trillion tons of CO2 emissions. In the entirety of the dynamic. Twice that of China, the second largest contributor. That, not considering India is only in that position because of the corporate entities based in the west. Obviously, that is not the case with China.
Anyone arguing that 2+2 does not equal 4 is not worth one’s attention.
I am convinced that there is very little credible science behind the CO2 as pollutant argument.....at best, 2+2 looks like it might equal 4, I'm afraid.
The real world doesn’t give a fuck about your beliefs. Coincidentally, neither do I.
Somehow I am not surprised by your response. .....
Great conversation! In my own life, I don't often get a chance to express my (unpopular) views, 'cos my old leftie colleagues just kind of exiled me when I didn't/couldn't swallow the (various forms of) Kool-Aid. An abyss opened up between us, & it appears to be un-bridgeable (fortunately I do have many like-minded friends). I get to practice saying hard things with my grown daughters, who don't always want to hear what Mom has to say on certain topics. They still love me, even though they sometimes find me a pain in the ass! I've always had the writing outlet, too, where I can say difficult things to those who are prepared to read me. And now - something puzzled me in the conversation with Bruce Pardy. Julie, you started to quote something he'd said about climate change at some gathering or lecture, but you didn't say the whole thing. I was waiting with bated breath for it, since climate change has long occupied a big portion of my mind (30+ years doing environmental activism/writing) & I'm still open to learning where I may've gone down a wrong road in my thinking. Finally, I just love the way you concluded the podcast, with those words of wisdom about "the road less travelled." I've definitely lived the road less travelled, & it has been hugely rewarding!
Julie is sitting in for Trish! What a supply Trish got!! Well worth our time. Here is a gentle voice with a warrior heart and a brain that reasons and communicates with such clarity. Thanks Trish for reaching out to Julie. Julie, I am forever grateful for your presence in those moments when no one spoke out and all seemed to be disappearing, disappointing and demanding. When family, friends, faith leaders all collapsed to the narrative. Caught in this new reality, your voice was a lighthouse of hope, of sanity and of fight against what was unreal. As time worn on your speaking engagements, your interviews and your book(My Choice) instilled a vision of a discernment and new direction of coping. Thank you, thank you, 🙏🏼 I am so enjoying the latest book (Our Last Innocent Moment). Your voice will forever be held in my heart as a beacon of hope.
Anne, I couldn’t have put this any better. Warrior heart and lighthouse of hope indeed! Dr Julie will forever be a hero to me, a 59 year old (now retired!) teacher who barely survived the woke environment that surrounded me during covid. I just finished “Our Last Innocent Moment” and will confess, I teared up at many points, not just for my own pain but for Julie’s. I felt it coming through the pages. What it has cost her emotionally to save us, I can only imagine, but save us she did.❤️
Beautiful write up. I'm eager to listen to this week's pod, as well.
During Covid I resented feeling the need to keep silent, that my family couldn't handle considering anything other than 'Trump bad, Fauci right.' I have silently stewed in resentment on other topics over the last 9 years, as well.
Today this has been replaced by an oft-repeating pattern of me following my own curiosity to determine what I feel to be true and leaving others to do the same (or not.) I do engage with any who are willing to talk. And my wish is for everyone to activate their own critical thinking, knowing mine needs regular exercise, as well. Silence seems a sort of grace to me now - toward myself and others.
This doesn't mean I'm always interested in staying with people where they are, though. And definitely not on holiday ;)
Lots to think about here. I could write a post in response to almost everything said.
To focus on one thing. Yes we need to reframe the debate back to first principles with respect to the rule of law. Yes, we are now in the "rule by law". Yes, we need to focus the law on preventing violence & harm at the most basic level because we have lost sight of why we have laws, and now the laws are becoming irrational & random.
Order & Chaos are required for life. A perfectly ordered universe is DEAD. A Chaotic Universe will consume itself. Life, and progress happen at the boundary between Order & Chaos. The place where the answer is "Yes", "No", and "Maybe". The "Maybe" is hard because it is the wild card. The place where where things will happen we don't like or approve of is hard to accept. It is much easier to believe that everyone should do exactly as we say, and if they did the World would be perfect.
Since we are living by the "Rule of Laws" we have lost sight of what the Harms are that the rules are to prevent. The Rules have become the end, and the harm they are to prevent has been forgotten and the end result is not Order, but Chaos.
hear hear :-))
I am listening to this with interest. I think one of the issues that Julie has had (Less so Bruce, but still) is that they are in academia, which has always been notoriously political. In normal life, its easier to speak out, albeit at the risk of losing a few friends.
Academe was not political until Ronald Reagan is the one who started the corporate cancer of state universities, on a departmental level.
In my own personal experience, the further away an institution or organization is from being directly responsible for delivering goods or services into a marketplace, the more room there is for nonsense, politics and infighting. Research institutions etc are among the worst for this.
I dont know about that, exactly, but Sayre's quote from the 1970s sums sit up: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sayre%27s_law#:~:text=On%2020%20December%201973%2C%20the%20Wall%20Street%20Journal,of%20politics%2C%20because%20the%20stakes%20are%20so%20low.%22
University of Guelph, Western, UBC et al alumni, hang your heads in eternal shame...your university took tax payer money to promote coercion causing injury and death. Shameful and unexcusable.
thank you, Julie. an excellent exposition re the necessity of SPEAKING, and I would add NAMING, per Mary Daly
Thought provoking, to be reminded that silence is too often serving the interests of others. It is challenging to navigate - trying to keep connected enough to our people, that they dare open to our dissent, requires not jumping on every issue. But too easily this becomes perceived as agreement with all manner of dangerous ideas.
Though I appreciate the metaphor in context, one thought on NPCs etc that bubbled for me: more than anything else, we gotta get out of the scripted, coded game altogether, whenever possible. Because while playable characters are certainly restricted by skill level and contrived to perform only as avatars of those "outside" the game, NPCs have even less agency, relegated to simply advancing the vision of the game's creators by their unconscious actions. I fear the silence you describe is more like becoming an NPC, actually. So I think again: how best not to step into that coded world in the first place?
What Americans do need to do ... is speak up ... to save their lives ...
I wrote my 'Twelve Posts Till WWIII' for Kiwis ... but they apply even more so to Americans ...
This is my twelfth post ...
https://windowsontheworld.substack.com/p/why-kiwis-are-doomed
And for those that are interested in 'Enemy' ... one of the cleverest films of all time .. I'm the guy who decoded it ... you can check out my analysis here .... on my 'Keep Your Eye On The Donut' blog
https://plisskenboon.blogspot.com/
regards
pb
Would you be so kind as to furnish an explanation of your position on this platform?
Not quite sure what you are asking Hudson ...
I’m thinking we should’ve addressed this topic in the month of February, 1981.